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GT = Wake Forest?

  • I refuse to believe that our talent is this bad; perhaps just our elite talent? I don't know. HD posted a list of all the watchlists and their reps from the ACC on her blog and I got to thinking that GT must be the only school with only 1 player on only 1 watchlist. Here's the breakdown (and pasting tables from excel sucks):

    School / # Award Watchlists
    Florida State 18
    North Carolina 17
    Miami 16
    Virginia Tech 14
    Boston College 12
    Clemson 8
    Maryland 8
    Duke 6
    Virginia 6
    NC State 4
    Wake Forest 1
    Georgia Tech 1

    Grand Total 111

    School / # Unique Players
    North Carolina 9
    Miami 8
    Florida State 8
    Duke 6
    Virginia Tech 6
    Boston College 6
    Clemson 5
    Virginia 4
    Maryland 4
    NC State 3
    Wake Forest 1
    Georgia Tech 1

    Grand Total 61

    Thoughts?

    This post has been edited 2 times, most recently by GT Guy 3 years ago

  • The team is in a transitional period where some guys that will get a lot of PT and who have playmaking ability are young.

    If you are an optimist you will compare our situation right now to Paul Johnson's 1st year ('08) where the young talent stepped up.

    Georgia Tech Football Talk at: http://GTSportsTalk.com

  • Good. Let em underestimate us. Tech plays better when overlooked. Cpj shouldn't have any motivation issues this year. Honestly I expect a much improved team effort this year. Certainly won't be just "rolling our helmets" out on the field mentality.

  • u can't let something like this get you down one bit about this season. IMO, the last thing anyone on this team needs going into this season is individual attention for anything. it's a good thing we're underdogs and overlooked. besides, look how ridiculous the JN for heisman campaign turned out to be last season. sure, it was a cute concept. but, it should have been pulled seconds after our first game.

    we need to focus on winning as a TEAM. then, individual stats will follow.

    This post was edited by stonedwall 3 years ago

  • GT Guy said... (original post)

    Good. Let em underestimate us. Tech plays better when overlooked. Cpj shouldn't have any motivation issues this year. Honestly I expect a much improved team effort this year. Certainly won't be just "rolling our helmets" out on the field mentality.

    I feel the same. Let them predict us as going 3-9 again too. All the more motivation to do well.

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  • Jim Hart said... (original post)

    The team is in a transitional period where some guys that will get a lot of PT and who have playmaking ability are young.

    If you are an optimist you will compare our situation right now to Paul Johnson's 1st year ('08) where the young talent stepped up.

    Good comparison, but even that team had much more proven talent than this one (Gardner, Burnett, Johnson, Walker, Richard). This is a year where everything is really riding on a bunch of guys that haven't done it on the collegiate level yet. We really don't have any proven veterans to carry us through the rough patches early in the season.

  • TheChamp said... (original post)

    Good comparison, but even that team had much more proven talent than this one (Gardner, Burnett, Johnson, Walker, Richard). This is a year where everything is really riding on a bunch of guys that haven't done it on the collegiate level yet. We really don't have any proven veterans to carry us through the rough patches early in the season.

    we are young and mostly unproven, i agree with you there. but, i respectfully disagree with your last comment. veterans or not, we have enough talent on this team to weather rough patches in our first three games versus western carolina, MTSU, and kansas at home. if we had MTSU, virginia tech, then FSU i'd be much more inclined to agree with you.

    we've got a god-send of a schedule to begin this season considering where we stand. we really need to make hay in those games!

  • Just remember that Paul has had a focus on Georiga Talent. GA is in the top 4 or 3 in talent for D1. I think we will be just fine. There will be a few surprises this year.

    With everything that has go on this offseason you have to go in expecting a 7-5 with the hope and delight of being 9-3 or great and wishing hard we dont have another 6-7 season. The talent is there, we just have not seen any football in over 7 months. Hard to judge. I can do a lot of things in 7 months. I hope our players have as well.

    "A sure way to hit a par is to leave a four foot birdie putt two inches from the hole."

  • Neither team will finish last in their division, bank on it. I'll even go so far as to say both will be in the hunt for their divisions goin into November.

  • Well, we did almost lose to Wake last year.

    This team is full of unknowns soon to be discovered for better or worse.

  • stonedwall said... (original post)

    u can't let something like this get you down one bit about this season. IMO, the last thing anyone on this team needs going into this season is individual attention for anything. it's a good thing we're underdogs and overlooked. besides, look how ridiculous the JN for heisman campaign turned out to be last season. sure, it was a cute concept. but, it should have been pulled seconds after our first game.

    we need to focus on winning as a TEAM. then, individual stats will follow.

    Understood, but the comparison is appropriate. Both programs are led by men that are generally acknowledged to be excellent coaches, but both programs have enjoyed LIMITED AND SPOTTY SUCCESS under those coaches. Both programs have extremely challenging recruiting environments---Tech against Georgia, Wake against the other North Carolina programs. Neither has the rabid, widespread fan base compared to the large state schools, and neither has the resources or financial wherewithal to compete effectively against most their competition. Both programs are in such tenuous positions year in and year out that one significant event such as the loss ONE key player, ONE whacky bounce of the ball, or ONE crazy ruling by the conference or the NCAA has the potential to completely derail a season, and possibly affect several seasons. Both programs live on the edge with little margin for error whether it be in personnel or in performance.

  • GTmoney said... (original post)

    Just remember that Paul has had a focus on Georiga Talent. GA is in the top 4 or 3 in talent for D1. I think we will be just fine. There will be a few surprises this year.

    With everything that has go on this offseason you have to go in expecting a 7-5 with the hope and delight of being 9-3 or great and wishing hard we dont have another 6-7 season. The talent is there, we just have not seen any football in over 7 months. Hard to judge. I can do a lot of things in 7 months. I hope our players have as well.

    No sir, the talent is not there. It may, indeed, all come together, but it won't be because we have top flight players. It will be ONLY if they play over their heads, receive top flight coaching, and catch more than a few breaks---and we get some of our opponents to significantly under-perform on the days they play us.

  • Yukonwreck said... (original post)

    No sir, the talent is not there. It may, indeed, all come together, but it won't be because we have top flight players. It will be ONLY if they play over their heads, receive top flight coaching, and catch more than a few breaks---and we get some of our opponents to significantly under-perform on the days they play us.

    i guess it depends on how we define talent. if talent is defined by experienced, proven quantities across the board i'd say we're lacking. if talent is described more in terms of potential to excel, we certainly have some talent on this team. case in point our secondary. we definitely have some talent and great potential. but, we sorely lack in experience and reps under pressure. they've got a lot to prove this season.

    on offense i don't think we have to significantly play over our heads to move the football. that's one plus to the offense we play. however, on the defensive side of the ball, we are gonna need some guys to have career games. and, unless i'm totally surprised by our special teams play in the first three games, they're gonna have to play above expectations.

  • Actually, Yes it is there.

    http://highschool.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1182411

    Georiga is #3 in top producing talent. We are also next to Florida which is #1. Even with the "non or lower" rated recuits, we are getting better talent than most.

    Why do you think we have been average before CPJ got here. Now he is here we have become above average with a chance to win the coastal each year.

    The main reason we were 6-7 last year is the way the football bounces and its the same reason we went to the Orange Bowl.

    "A sure way to hit a par is to leave a four foot birdie putt two inches from the hole."

  • GTmoney said... (original post)

    Actually, Yes it is there.

    http://highschool.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1182411

    Georiga is #3 in top producing talent. We are also next to Florida which is #1. Even with the "non or lower" rated recuits, we are getting better talent than most.

    Why do you think we have been average before CPJ got here. Now he is here we have become above average with a chance to win the coastal each year.

    The main reason we were 6-7 last year is the way the football bounces and its the same reason we went to the Orange Bowl.

    The talent has always been there. I think people overestimate the gap between being average and being great; in reality, it's a slim margin. It's not that our players are physically incapable of being great. Most of the time, the team that wins is the one that plays harder, tougher, and smarter.

    The difference between average and great is in the mind, not in the body.

    This post was edited by pckl300 3 years ago

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  • stonedwall said... (original post)

    i guess it depends on how we define talent. if talent is defined by experienced, proven quantities across the board i'd say we're lacking. if talent is described more in terms of potential to excel, we certainly have some talent on this team. case in point our secondary. we definitely have some talent and great potential. but, we sorely lack in experience and reps under pressure. they've got a lot to prove this season.

    on offense i don't think we have to significantly play over our heads to move the football. that's one plus to the offense we play. however, on the defensive side of the ball, we are gonna need some guys to have career games. and, unless i'm totally surprised by our special teams play in the first three games, they're gonna have to play above expectations.

    In arguably the most important position on the offense, O-line, we are going to START Tyler Kidney. With all due respect to Tyler, he is a "former walk-on", and not a RS Senior former walk-on with 25 or 30 prior starts--he's a RS Soph former walk-on with no prior starts and playing time in parts of six games in an understudy role, as a RS freshman. Yes, I realize that in order to one day be a former walk-on RS senior with 25 starts, he needs to be playing this year--and, hell, he might be an Outland Trophy finalist one day. But as of today, former walk-on, never started one game, Tyler Kidney cannot be beaten out of the starting line-up by ANYBODY that we scouted and recruited and ultimately offered. That tells me where we are talent wise at tackle. I don't say that this scenario is repeated at several positions, but it just indicates in general where we are in the building (or re-building) of this team----still at Square One.

  • GTmoney said... (original post)

    Actually, Yes it is there.

    http://highschool.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1182411

    Georiga is #3 in top producing talent. We are also next to Florida which is #1. Even with the "non or lower" rated recuits, we are getting better talent than most.

    Why do you think we have been average before CPJ got here. Now he is here we have become above average with a chance to win the coastal each year.

    The main reason we were 6-7 last year is the way the football bounces and its the same reason we went to the Orange Bowl.

    So except for the 20 or so big, elite, factory programs, you are saying we are "getting better talent than most". So we have better players that, what, 85 of the 119 Division I teams? Coach Johnson has a bit of splainin' to do, doesn't he?

    I would disagree with you---emphatically. We don't even get the talent that 8 or nine of the other ACC schools get. We can't touch any school in the SEC save Vanderbilt, probably none of the Big Ten but Northwestern, half the Big East, most of the Big 12, most of the Pac 10 etc. We are in the player pool with many teams in Conference USA and Mountain West, but we have fewer opportunities because of our academics--and reptutation.

  • pckl300 said... (original post)

    The talent has always been there. I think people overestimate the gap between being average and being great; in reality, it's a slim margin. It's not that our players are physically incapable of being great. Most of the time, the team that wins is the one that plays harder, tougher, and smarter.

    The difference between average and great is in the mind, not in the body.

    CPJ should contact the Zenmaster, Phil Jackson.

  • Yukonwreck said... (original post)

    So except for the 20 or so big, elite, factory programs, you are saying we are "getting better talent than most". So we have better players than, what, 85 of the 119 Division I teams? Coach Johnson has a bit of splainin' to do, doesn't he?

    I would say we're on par with VT's talent level. FSU and Miami have had talent surges as of late, but there's no reason we can't recruit on that level, we just have to win more games. They have factory hype to help them recruit; we don't. We have to do it the hard way.

    And to hammer in my last point again, don't think that FSU and Miami are leaps and bounds above us in recruiting. The difference in talent is marginal, maybe even statistically insignificant. Any Division I player is talented enough to beat any other Division I player one-on-one.

    Why would you say that CPJ has to defend himself? Hasn't he proved his merit to you? Or does last season undo everything?

    This post was edited by pckl300 3 years ago

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  • Yukonwreck said... (original post)

    In arguably the most important position on the offense, O-line, we are going to START Tyler Kidney. With all due respect to Tyler, he is a "former walk-on", and not a RS Senior former walk-on with 25 or 30 prior starts--he's a RS Soph former walk-on with no prior starts and playing time in parts of six games in an understudy role, as a RS freshman. Yes, I realize that in order to one day be a former walk-on RS senior with 25 starts, he needs to be playing this year--and, hell, he might be an Outland Trophy finalist one day. But as of today, former walk-on, never started one game, Tyler Kidney cannot be beaten out of the starting line-up by ANYBODY that we scouted and recruited and ultimately offered. That tells me where we are talent wise at tackle. I don't say that this scenario is repeated at several positions, but it just indicates in general where we are in the building (or re-building) of this team----still at Square One.

    if our entire OL was made up of walk-ons with hardly a snap under their belt i'd be MUCH more worried! at this point i'm just worried . . .

    i wonder if kidney will still be in the starting role come first game? if i recall correctly, he gotta considerable amount of playing time in the spring due to injuries of other linemen. hopefully, everyone will be healthy and ready to go come practice time in a few weeks. then, you have joe and mason coming on board--both 300lbs'ers as incoming freshmen. i'm not suggesting they're gonna come in and make an impact. but, it's not outside the realm of possibilities they push for playing time as true freshman.

  • Yukonwreck said... (original post)

    In arguably the most important position on the offense, O-line, we are going to START Tyler Kidney. With all due respect to Tyler, he is a "former walk-on",

    And why is that a bad thing? If he's a walk on that has beaten out the scholarship players, then I'm excited. He must have earned it.

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  • pckl300 said... (original post)

    I would say we're on par with VT's talent level. FSU and Miami have had talent surges as of late, but there's no reason we can't recruit on that level, we just have to win more games. They have factory hype to help them recruit; we don't. We have to do it the hard way.

    And to hammer in my last point again, don't think that FSU and Miami are leaps and bounds above us in recruiting. The difference in talent is marginal, maybe even statistically insignificant. Any Division I player is talented enough to beat any other Division I player one-on-one.

    Why would you say that CPJ has to defend himself? Hasn't he proved his merit to you? Or does last season undo everything?

    Last season doesn't undo everything, but the Kansas game, the Georgia game, and the Air Force game, does undo a whole helluva lot. And if you are correct and we have very nearly the talent that FSU and Miami (why not just throw in Ohio State, Alabama, LSU, Boise, Florida, while we're at it) then it probably would undo everything. Everybody in the ACC except Duke and Wake should have better players than we do every year. EVERY YEAR. That isn't our fault, that is just uneven the recruiting field is. Grobe has had success only because he manages his players better than most in the league.

  • Yukonwreck said... (original post)

    Last season doesn't undo everything, but the Kansas game, the Georgia game, and the Air Force game, does undo a whole helluva lot. And if you are correct and we have very nearly the talent that FSU and Miami (why not just throw in Ohio State, Alabama, LSU, Boise, Florida, while we're at it) then it probably would undo everything.

    I would say we very nearly do have the talent of all of those schools. But don't mistake talent for success. Ask Mack Brown about that one.

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  • pckl300 said... (original post)

    I would say we very nearly do have the talent of all of those schools. But don't mistake talent for success. Ask Mack Brown about that one.

    Touche'. It was all Muschamp anyway!coolcool

  • on the offensive side of the coin, i could care less about everyone else's perceived talent as long as we are recruiting the kinda boys we need for our system. i think navy has proven you can move the ball and score in this division with essentially FCS sized players and talent on offense as long as the players execute.

    however, on the defensive side of the ball, we definitely need our fair share of proven talent and some genuine stars. missing out on tuitt hurt.

    if we field a top-10 D and have the consistency and tenacity of the navy O we'll be damn tough to beat. i don't think it's pie in the sky to think we can do this. it won't be the coming season, though!

  • If you want to have some basis for comparison. Go watch uga, fsu and uf practice. They have more talent on the bench, for the most part, than we do playing. They also have places to hide them in school.